Is R. Dorothy "fully functional"?

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Originally posted by Son_of_Horus It's this one. It's really quite funny. Erm... Dorothy get's a little bit miffed at Roger's insensitivity, and uhm... concentrates her "light" to make a point. I wish my chatbot had that function.

Poor Roger. I feel sorry for him.

Maybe I can do that to Manfred . . .

Manfred: O_O Lothar! Help me!

Did you get that off of that one site? I saw it on there before. *is not posting link because site is bad*

As for Dorothy being fully functional . . .why wouldn't she be, if she is supposed to be able to mimic human activity?

I think some people are confusing sex with love... ^_^;;;

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Originally posted by number9 I think some people are confusing sex with love... ^_^;;;

Well, I think what some of us are worried about it that sex is an important element in a successful marriage (or long-term romantic pairing). Humans have physical needs.

I kinda had trouble with the end of Chobits because of this. Chi can't, well, let's say, address a certain physical need of Hideki's. And the ending of that series seemed a little too idealistic to me. No matter how much Hideki loves Chi he is still a horny little teenager. And prolly not imediently, but sometime in the future those needs are going to demand that they be addressed and then Hideki's going to be in a whole world of trouble with that persocom.

In maybe I'm just frigid. But I've always thought that while sex isn't the most important thing in a successful romantic relationship, it is certainly an important thing.

If Dorothy can't have sex it'd put a huge roadblock in their relatioship. The line from act 18 carefully removes the 'but she can't provide you with what you need' arguement from Dorothy and Roger's relationship.

Although you are right. Some people do confuse love with sex and we prolly need to keep that in mind whenever talking about Dorothy like this. Not that anyone in this thread has implied anything like that ^_^


muchlove
-dork

p.s. I mis-spelled 'arguement', didn't I?

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Originally posted by Dork I kinda had trouble with the end of Chobits because of this. Chi can't, well, let's say, address a certain physical need of Hideki's. And the ending of that series seemed a little too idealistic to me.

It bugged me for the exact same reason, especially because they had played up the attraction so much. I mean, what did it prove?

It's not necessarily the be all and end all (although I suppose for everyone there are moments that it is ), but it is an important part of the human experience. Why bother to make an android pass for human in every way and then neglect it? It makes no sense to me.

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Originally posted by Dork quote: Originally posted by number9 I think some people are confusing sex with love... ^_^;;; Well, I think what some of us are worried about it that sex is an important element in a successful marriage (or long-term romantic pairing). Humans have physical needs. I kinda had trouble with the end of Chobits because of this. Chi can't, well, let's say, address a certain physical need of Hideki's. And the ending of that series seemed a little too idealistic to me. No matter how much Hideki loves Chi he is still a horny little teenager. And prolly not imediently, but sometime in the future those needs are going to demand that they be addressed and then Hideki's going to be in a whole world of trouble with that persocom. In maybe I'm just frigid. But I've always thought that while sex isn't the most important thing in a successful romantic relationship, it is certainly an important thing. If Dorothy can't have sex it'd put a huge roadblock in their relatioship. The line from act 18 carefully removes the 'but she can't provide you with what you need' arguement from Dorothy and Roger's relationship. Although you are right. Some people do confuse love with sex and we prolly need to keep that in mind whenever talking about Dorothy like this. Not that anyone in this thread has implied anything like that ^_^ muchlove -dork p.s. I mis-spelled 'arguement', didn't I?

My take on the matter is that Timothy Wayneright knew he wasn't going to live forever, and wanted to give R. Dorothy the same opportunity for happiness that his real daughter would have had.
I believe that he viewed himself not merely as Dorthy's creator but as her actual "father". R.Dorothy even referred to him as such.

I think what a lot of people here are missing out on is Angel's dropping the pistol and basically leaving Dorothy at the hands of the Boogieman, Alan Gabriel.
At first she wants to save Dorothy, and then she realizes that this is her competition...no, wait... she's a machine... she can't be, but she is... she can...aaaarrrrggggghhhh!
She's caught in this emotional conflict over saving this "girl", and he disire to convince herself that this is just a "machine" which is her competition.
And HOW is IT her competition?
How could IT possibly be HER competition?
In disbelief she grabs her head and drops the gun.

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Originally posted by Son_of_Horus quote: Originally posted by Dork quote: Originally posted by number9 I think some people are confusing sex with love... ^_^;;; Well, I think what some of us are worried about it that sex is an important element in a successful marriage (or long-term romantic pairing). Humans have physical needs. I kinda had trouble with the end of Chobits because of this. Chi can't, well, let's say, address a certain physical need of Hideki's. And the ending of that series seemed a little too idealistic to me. No matter how much Hideki loves Chi he is still a horny little teenager. And prolly not imediently, but sometime in the future those needs are going to demand that they be addressed and then Hideki's going to be in a whole world of trouble with that persocom. In maybe I'm just frigid. But I've always thought that while sex isn't the most important thing in a successful romantic relationship, it is certainly an important thing. If Dorothy can't have sex it'd put a huge roadblock in their relatioship. The line from act 18 carefully removes the 'but she can't provide you with what you need' arguement from Dorothy and Roger's relationship. Although you are right. Some people do confuse love with sex and we prolly need to keep that in mind whenever talking about Dorothy like this. Not that anyone in this thread has implied anything like that ^_^ muchlove -dork p.s. I mis-spelled 'arguement', didn't I? My take on the matter is that Timothy Wayneright knew he wasn't going to live forever, and wanted to give R. Dorothy the same opportunity for happiness that his real daughter would have had. I believe that he viewed himself not merely as Dorthy's creator but as her actual "father". R.Dorothy even referred to him as such. I think what a lot of people here are missing out on is Angel's dropping the pistol and basically leaving Dorothy at the hands of the Boogieman, Alan Gabriel. At first she wants to save Dorothy, and then she realizes that this is her competition...no, wait... she's a machine... she can't be, but she is... she can...aaaarrrrggggghhhh! She's caught in this emotional conflict over saving this "girl", and he disire to convince herself that this is just a "machine" which is her competition. And HOW is IT her competition? How could IT possibly be HER competition? In disbelief she grabs her head and drops the gun.

Amen, brother! I am stoked that someone shed light on this scene. Kudos!

I don't buy it. I mean, sure, Angel failed to kill Alan in Act 21. This is true. But she also failed to kill him in NEGOTIATION WITH THE DEAD, and urged Dastun to do it instead. Why? We know she was carrying a pistol with a full clip -- we saw her load it after she blew away the android in Wayneright's house. Whatever her motivation, it wasn't based on her desire to get rid of Dorothy.

Also, in MISSING CAT, she failed to shoot the guards, but tossed her pistol to Roger instead. Why?

Also, in Act 25, she failed to shoot Vera. Why?

That's four failures to pull the trigger out of five attempts. The only exception was with the scary android in Wayneright's house.

Since Angel has a perfect track record of choking when it comes to shooting humans, all the smart money is on the idea that, if it had been someone other than Dorothy, Angel still wouldn't have pulled the trigger. She would have choked regardless. So the identity of the person under Alan's drill had no significance as far as her decision to shoot was concerned.

On the other hand, her humiliation at being seen to fail is very significant.

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Originally posted by A Clockwork Tomato I don't buy it. I mean, sure, Angel failed to kill Alan in Act 21. This is true. But she also failed to kill him in NEGOTIATION WITH THE DEAD, and urged Dastun to do it instead. Why? We know she was carrying a pistol with a full clip -- we saw her load it after she blew away the android in Wayneright's house. Whatever her motivation, it wasn't based on her desire to get rid of Dorothy. Also, in MISSING CAT, she failed to shoot the guards, but tossed her pistol to Roger instead. Why? Also, in Act 25, she failed to shoot Vera. Why? That's four failures to pull the trigger out of five attempts. The only exception was with the scary android in Wayneright's house. Since Angel has a perfect track record of choking when it comes to shooting humans, all the smart money is on the idea that, if it had been someone other than Dorothy, Angel still wouldn't have pulled the trigger. She would have choked regardless. So the identity of the person under Alan's drill had no significance as far as her decision to shoot was concerned. On the other hand, her humiliation at being seen to fail is very significant.

HA HA!
On guard Robespierre!

She gave Dastun the opportunity because he screwed up when he missed Alan the first time. (You know the way Dastun is) "What are you telling me roger, are you telling me that I can't defend this city?"
He and Angel had a tender moment there alone when he handed her back her gun.

In Missing Cat, she didn't "fail" to shoot the guards, Roger was just at a better angle, to address the volley of bullets.

And as for Vera, VERA was her "Mother" during the human integration period of her development.

Or are we also forgetting that "Angel" as a living memory is a part of the machine itself and has been much more than Emma Peale in a city of amnesia?

If I remember correctly she was also the mother of Mr. Wise's bastard
son as evidenced by the prominent painting of her over the mantle in episode 9, Beck Comes Back!

That's telling me that for a gal around 65 or so, Angel's looking pretty hot.

Lol Man ! WOA Check OUT DOROTHY In THAT MANGA !



I don't believe that this can't be an actual Manga Guy's please tell me about this and what website you got this from or if you want to tell me this is Aol Instant Messenger let me know I got it !

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Originally Posted By Wazpy -Heh...that's not exactly official...and they're not having realations...she's kinda preventing that from happening at all

Ok..not having relations..and She's kinda preventing from that happening ..ok tell me something Einstein ..If she's preventing from that happening at all then .....WHY THE HELL IS SHE HALF NAKED IN FRONT OF ROGER WITH NOTHING UNDER HER AS SHOWN ON THIS PICTURE ???!!AND WHAT IS SHE DOING IN THE BATHROOM WITH ROGER ..LIKE THAT ??!! So this means that Roger most definately Scored !

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Originally posted by Zola I would tend to think so. One of the other things that tells us that most androids in the Big-O verse probably are fully functional is Beck's immediate assumption that Dorothy is Roger's lover. Angel confirms this when she spoiler (highlight to read): accuses Roger of being in love with Dorothy when he won't kiss her. Think about that for a sec. Angel is trying to get him to kiss her and likely more. If he was unable to do that with Dorothy, she would have said something like "you know she can't be what you want her to be" or some such, and she wouldn't have been a BIT jealous or upset. What would there have been to get upset over if Dorothy could not compete with her in every way? Also think about Angel asking Dorothy for forgiveness. She hugs her--ie, she treats her just like she would another girl. One last piece of evidence is again in The Greatest Villain when Dastun starts to say "what can an android... what can a GIRL do?" If she wasn't a "real" girl, they wouldn't be treating her like one. I put that part in spoiler tags for our friends across the pond who haven't seen all the eps yet.

I'm shamefully late in commenting on this. This is a very powerful method of analysis, and dead on in this case, I think. The reactions of the characters in a show tells us a lot about their beliefs (if the show is well written).

If Dorothy weren't "fully functional," then falling in love with an android is like falling in love with someone who is happily married. It can cause heartache, but isn't likely to lead anywhere.

If Angel felt this were the case, her reaction would probably be something like, "You poor boy. How awful for you! You must be terribly frustrated. Isn't there anything I can do to help?"

This isn't what happened at all!

Also, Roger's attitude seems a lot more like active denial to me than basic ignorance. There's no point being in denial about something unless it's true!

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Originally posted by Dork Since she's animated we don't pay as much attention to it but we've seen her elbows, fingers, neck (+ clevage ), knees and ankles and we've never seen anything resembling a robotic joint.

And who in the HELL says we don't pay attention? Well, maybe not Dorothy but there IS a certain schoolgirl...

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Originally posted by Barrin So, what you are asking is if she is "anatomically correct?" Many androids were built to be humanoid, but have little refinement to look natural. When R. Dorothy is built, she is given very human appearence. Timothy Wayneright, her builder, was compared to a story of an emperor who liked the song of a mechanical bird. R. Dorothy is built to look like is late daughter. So, the determining quesion is this: Was she built as a mechanical bird, to sing and look pretty, or is she built as a sort of replacement dororthy, with all the possibilities that the origional had? If it's the first choice, then only the visiple parts are needed, and unless old Timmy intended her to sing in the nude, there's no need to give her a supple body. If it's the latter, then she's built to be as close to a lady as possible. She has feeling (though they often remain hidden), and to be as human as possible she would be built to enjoy certain human pleasures. I feel dirty now for some reason...

I think Barrin made the best point I've seen thus far! She has proven, as early as episode one, that she IS a real lady, with real emotion...if you look strictly at the FACTS there can be little doubt she is human in every way. This means she's also a sexual being.

However, does she get physical pleasure? Hmm...considering she can't taste, I wonder if she feels it. No doubt she has the necessary equipment, but what of the pleasure?

I don't think she attains PHYSICAL pleasure; however, Dorothy has already proven that she is EMOTIONAL, despite being an android, so I'm guessing her feelings would be emotionally enhanced during the sexual act.

To make her have sexual pleasure and not be able to taste would mean "Timmy" focused on the sexual area...which I sincerely doubt. He included it, but didn't focus on it.

sexsexsexsexsex...sorry, just trying to see how many times I could say it in one sentence.

Is R. Dorothy "fully functional"?

Hmmmm.

*sits back in chair; ponders; scratches chin; reaches for cigarette and flicks lighter 'til he remembers he doesn't smoke*

My gut feeling is a resounding YES!

Though perhaps if we were to meet and the subject turned up, I'd fib, saying that I was a Doubting Thomas.

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Originally posted by Hanyou However, does she get physical pleasure? Hmm...considering she can't taste, I wonder if she feels it. No doubt she has the necessary equipment, but what of the pleasure? I don't think she attains PHYSICAL pleasure; however, Dorothy has already proven that she is EMOTIONAL, despite being an android, so I'm guessing her feelings would be emotionally enhanced during the sexual act. To make her have sexual pleasure and not be able to taste would mean "Timmy" focused on the sexual area...which I sincerely doubt. He included it, but didn't focus on it. sexsexsexsexsex...sorry, just trying to see how many times I could say it in one sentence.

Good point, but you have to leave the writers room for an interesting story line. Remember, Dorothy is "evolving".
In my fan fiction, Dorothy actually discovers the taste of hot sauce with hilarious results, much to poor Roger's dismay.
I would imagine that her sexuality would evolve along the same lines.
Although extremely late in her development judging from her anatomy, I imagine it would be like some kind of a ROBO-puberty, lol

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Originally posted by Son_of_Horus Good point, but you have to leave the writers room for an interesting story line. Remember, Dorothy is "evolving". In my fan fiction, Dorothy actually discovers the taste of hot sauce with hilarious results, much to poor Roger's dismay. I would imagine that her sexuality would evolve along the same lines. Although extremely late in her development judging from her anatomy, I imagine it would be like some kind of a ROBO-puberty, lol

Hmm.... there are lots of people who have no sense of taste who enjoy sex very much.

We know she has tactile sense even though they never come out and say it. We know this because she can manipulate objects in the world. She can pick things up and open doors and command Big O... how could she do that without some kind of sensory feedback? If there were some kind of database that contained the specifics for every item she might possibly encounter that told the properties of each, she would need a computer the size of a building! You are talking billions of possible objects!

I'm not sure she necessarily feels pain, the evidence seems to say that she doesn't, but not feeling pain is not necessarily the same thing as not feeling. To her, at first it could just be another set of sensations that were neutral and over time she would learn to associate enjoyment with them.

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Originally posted by Barrin So, what you are asking is if she is "anatomically correct?" Many androids were built to be humanoid, but have little refinement to look natural. When R. Dorothy is built, she is given very human appearence. Timothy Wayneright, her builder, was compared to a story of an emperor who liked the song of a mechanical bird. R. Dorothy is built to look like is late daughter. So, the determining quesion is this: Was she built as a mechanical bird, to sing and look pretty, or is she built as a sort of replacement dororthy, with all the possibilities that the origional had? If it's the first choice, then only the visiple parts are needed, and unless old Timmy intended her to sing in the nude, there's no need to give her a supple body. If it's the latter, then she's built to be as close to a lady as possible. She has feeling (though they often remain hidden), and to be as human as possible she would be built to enjoy certain human pleasures. I feel dirty now for some reason...

thats kinda what chobits was about
"there are some things she can do and soem things she cant"

I'm not sure how acceptable this is...but it does prove that cyborg organs can be created.


Last night we came up with an idea to protect men from being kicked in the crotch. The idea mainly consisted of replacing the sensitive organ with a cyborg version(so it wouldn't hurt) and giving it the added feature of giving the foe's foot an electric shock.

I dare not post the name as it is too funky for the board...but here's a picture of the prototype. This along with Zola's research(Mostly her research though ) makes me believe Dorothy is fully functional

• Attachment: elec.jpg

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Originally posted by Wazpy Last night we came up with an idea to protect men from being kicked in the crotch. The idea mainly consisted of replacing the sensitive organ with a cyborg version(so it wouldn't hurt) and giving it the added feature of giving the foe's foot an electric shock. I dare not post the name as it is too funky for the board...but here's a picture of the prototype. This along with Zola's research(Mostly her research though ) makes me believe Dorothy is fully functional

Forget the picture of the prototype. We need to see pictures of the testing!

Pygmalion

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Originally posted by Pygmalion quote: Originally posted by Wazpy Last night we came up with an idea to protect men from being kicked in the crotch. The idea mainly consisted of replacing the sensitive organ with a cyborg version(so it wouldn't hurt) and giving it the added feature of giving the foe's foot an electric shock. I dare not post the name as it is too funky for the board...but here's a picture of the prototype. This along with Zola's research(Mostly her research though ) makes me believe Dorothy is fully functional Forget the picture of the prototype. We need to see pictures of the testing! Pygmalion

Ok...this test will determine Dorothy's...uh...functionability...

• Attachment: electricles.jpg

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Originally posted by Hanyou To make her have sexual pleasure and not be able to taste would mean "Timmy" focused on the sexual area...which I sincerely doubt. He included it, but didn't focus on it.

To what extent did Wayneright actually DESIGN Dorothy, as opposed to constructing her from old plans? Dorothy insists in THE UNDERGROUND TERROR that Wayneright didn't understand how her mind worked. Does this fundamental underlying cluelessness apply to her body as well? Maybe her body was built to a set of specific plans, and all he customized was her appearance.

In this case, the question of what little girls are made of is not one that we can base on Wayneright's taste, or lack thereof.

To me, the close link that Dorothy has to Megadeuses and the apparent presence of probe-cable sockets in her skull implies that she is a very old design, one that, perhaps, Angel arranged to have Wayneright rediscover when she was setting up the current Cycle. In Roger's vision in Act 26, though possibly unreliable, we see Angel-as-Director with a blueprint and model of R. Dorothy.

So I wonder if (a) Wayneright's taste in android sexuality is really relevant, and also if (b) we should assume that Wayneright was conventional or moral in any meaningful sense. I suspect he may well have been like an older, less excitable Beck.

ACT's probably right.

I don't feel like explaining myself. My brain's not working right. So take this line from Dorothy for what you will:

Dorothy: "Even my father never obtained the knowledge of how I operate and could never hope the understand how I think."


muchlove
-dork