No Season 3

Well, "Big O" could be completely metaphorical but I believe that if my third theory is true, then it's inside Roger's mind (see "Roger the Wanderer") but that he is supposed to typify the illusions and false realities that we humans often construct in order to deal with the fact that life very often sucks. Most people believe they are morally better and more intelligent than they really are, in the same way that Roger

spoiler (highlight to read):

creates a fake reality for himself to distract him from the fact that he is a failure in his real life as seen in "Wanderer."

There's still no proof that anyone's theory is correct, though. The only way of knowing would be to ask one of the writers.

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Originally posted by clericblackdave The creators may do season 3. But it'll be for the money...

I'll bet that the creators drew paychecks for the first two seasons. I don't think they were a group of monastics who sit in their cloister and draw animation as a form of worship.

The first two seasons were great examples of commercial, profit-driven, money-grubbing animation. I'm just hoping that a third season won't cheapen itself by being too highfalutin' and sissified. They could easily overdo all the fancy-pants stuff that they did in Season 2, and wreck the show that way.

If they ever start going all psycho-drama on us, where people like Dastun or Roger stop doing their jobs and whining "Why, oh, why?" all the time, it will be very sad. I like the way, when something weird happens, they stare at it for a moment, then shake it off and go back to work.

I think you're idolizing season 2 too much... just because it's got an unclear ending doesn't mean it's deep.

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Originally posted by clericblackdave I would say that the people who want a 3rd season are perhaps too young, or too American, to understand the beauty of the 2nd season ending. Its like the way Akira was done. The ending isn't supposed to tie up every loose end perfectly. That is the way American Animation is typically done. Instead, it gives an ending which gives you a general sense of the ending while provoking thoughts about you own life and the meaning of existence. Maybe I'm just getting too old and thinking about death too much, but I feel like the ending is in line with the tastes of the supposed target audience.

Umm, this is insulting to me...

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Originally posted by Big Duo FanI think you're idolizing season 2 too much... just because it's got an unclear ending doesn't mean it's deep.

You pretty much hit it on the nose... The show may well be tied up in symbolism, but that doesn't rule out the possibility that there is a completely straightforward and probably simple explantation for things...


On another note, Tetsuo going spoodly at the end of that movie made my hair catch on fire. No joke.

All of this supposed heavy deepness that was in the last few episodes - especially the last half of #26 - didn't sink into my head one bit.
All it managed to do for me was make me scratch my head, wonder why in the world they decided to end the 2nd season like that , and go to the medicine cabinet for some asprin.

Because I feel this way, I'd want another season of The Big O so that these guys that wrote the show can make-up for what I feel to be a crap ending of an otherwise great show...even if it means switching brands of saki.

Although your theory is plausible, there's nothing to say that it's the One True Theory of the show.

I have to disagree with you, thouygh. The people who make anime are, generally, not psychoanalists and theolgians trying to enlighten the world through animation. They're usually a bunch of people who want to tell a cool story and maybe make some money off of merchandising.

And if it were true that the entire city only existed in one person's mind, then it completely nullifies everything presented in the show. None of the characters really matter, the whole theme of destiny versus free will has no meaning because they never existed.

There have been dozens of theories on these boards that deal with the ending, all of them different. Some are heavily psychological, some are heavily religous, but it is my opinion that these theories are trying to dive too deeply into the series. Yes, there's symbolism, but it's not composed completely 100% of nothing but symbolism.

Shouldn't we be asking are selves, if they make a season 3 will we like it? Instead of, would we like a season 3?

I haven't read every single post here, but I want to say this (forgive me if it's been said). Your theory is a very good and unique one to be sure, however, while taking a Psychology course one could say this is "Sigmund Freud" at work. However, one could just as easily say this is a show of religious metaphor dealing with the Book of Revelation, and in that case, it is not at the end yet. Notice the BIG's colors same as the Four Horseman.(just one of MANY examples that have gone through these forums before...there are literally hundreds of posts on the connections to the Bible, more so than Freud). I have a strong feeling the writers have more up their sleeve to this, and are merely awaiting the money to finish up this epic properly with an additional 26. I eagerly await that day.

The ending shows that Roger has failed. The RESET has occured again, but the main point has not changed. The memories are still gone. I understand what your saying, but I don't beleive that was the main point of this show. There was something that triggered this need for a RESET long ago. Because we have memories of a shining, spick-and-span Paradigm in Roger the Wanderer, and a world half in ruin the whole series and after the RESET of episode 26...buildings are still fallen over, etc.

Each RESET, something changes, man moves toward an ultimate goal and conflict. For instance, think of the past Rogers who have failed their mission--they died fighting in a war (what of them, there bodies are still present in the sea along with destroyed Megadei). There is evident build up toward a climax here, but the mastermind of Paradigm, whether it be Angel or someone else, is not allowing the resolution/ the final judgement to occur yet. Until man breaks the cycle, man will be a slave to a devil (angel?) basically, forcing them to live repressed lives of uncertainty. This world is in a Tribulation of sorts...not nessessarily biblical, but along those lines it seems.

You can't end a series totally properly with the future holding darkness and endless destruction of the same pattern over and over again. Gordon was quite clear he hired Roger to neogotiate in the past wit hthe creator, and he did not succeed, thus the need for the last RESET, but this time, despite Rogers efforts and gaining some ground evidently (as Angel and Dorothy are shown in the end of 26 now on the side of the road) he failed. He did not recover the memories, which was his purpose--Paradigm is still lost in twisted Amnesia as seen at the end of 26. We have no idea who Roger is yet, what's the connection of the lesser Domini like Benny w/ Osrail, the cause of the first Event and first RESET, etc. So much unanswered, too much to even remember really. Roger must continue on and COMPLETE his neogotiations. The series is meant for a Season 3 I beleive.

Note: Shwartzwald comes to a truth and realizes that all this time the world has "been a comedy". If he is a member of Freud's mind, he could not become self-concious of the 'TRUTH.' And Beck having connections with the BIG O, knowing its systems; and key point, line in ep 25 I think, Rosewater tells Beck his father 'didn't go far enough.' And don't think Gordon doesn't know more than he says. He knew the secret elevator and floor 666 (how do you explain that in Freudian?!--that is a strong reference for evil and thus, a world perhaps in the grip of an evil or destruction-minded entity--afterall, the same torturous history keeps repeating itself...it is never really a truth rebirth...it is always tainted thus far) Gordon talked with this "creator" to fill in a book with memories. The communication/knowledge levels are too strong to be Freudian. What of the "roger robot" visions. The assembly line. The creators threw those in there to dazzle us and leave us with more questions for season 3. At any rate, we'll have to wait for the horse's mouth to speak.

Last note: Just becuase BIG O is on Adult Swim doesn't mean its limited to Adults. It used to be on Toonami you know and was just as good. Intellegent kids and teens can get into it on a deep level just as easily. Toonami, which is often biasly labeled as 'for-kids' used to be the old adult swim of sorts, and carried with it many a fine anime like Gundam Wing, Robotech, and the Ronin Warriors. Each of which are edgy, adult-esque, with well-done to extremely complex plots. Anime is sterotyped as kiddy too often. There's ALOT of good stuff to be seen in it (despite there being a lot of dumb stuff as well).

'later

PS-- and if it wasn't clear, I've answered the question that HECK YES I want a season 3. I waited some 3 years for season 2 and emailed for its creation. I sure want a season 3 to end this gem of an anime series properly. I don't imagine the creators can screw it up. I mean, come on honestly. They obviously know what they're doing in the overall sense. They're not a Lucus here. They pulled off a heck of a job overall on Season 2 after like a 2 year hiatus. You can bet their minds are brewing with the rest of the tale. Let it be told! There's nothing to lose, and EVERYTHING to gain!

Very well said Dog. If you don't like the third season, then don't watch it. It's the same with the Star Wars prequels. I never really expected anything out of them and so I wasn't let down. A lot of people hate them. But that doesn't take away anything from the first three which were great.

It's a no-lose situation for me. I'm satisfied with the ending now and I'd love to watch a third season. I think the ratings will come through, if they made one, if CN takeS Big O away for a while and then reruns the first two seasons before running a third one.

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Originally posted by Pythagoras Very well said Dog. If you don't like the third season, then don't watch it. It's the same with the Star Wars prequels. I never really expected anything out of them and so I wasn't let down. A lot of people hate them. But that doesn't take away anything from the first three which were great. It's a no-lose situation for me. I'm satisfied with the ending now and I'd love to watch a third season. I think the ratings will come through, if they made one, if CN takeS Big O away for a while and then reruns the first two seasons before running a third one.

Yeah, what he said.

A lot of people have trouble expressing positive emotions in any but negative ways. So we don't hear "I loved the first two seasons!" Instead, we get "I just know I'd hate a third season." Kililng Big O is a way of preventing it from ever changing, and thus protecting it from a downhill slide.

In any event, what track record does anyone have of predicting the quality of an as-yet uncreated season? Sometimes sequels are as good as their predecessors. Sometimes they're better. Often they're worse. But few people have an accurately calibrated crystal ball to predict which one is going to fall into which category.

I would love to see a season 3. Or maybe even a sequel series, that would be awsome!I have posted a thread on adult swim under the name ZeroCindermane and everyone should put either a "heck yeah" or just a 'yes".

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Originally posted by clericblackdave From the explanations I've seen online, this show is over, and should be over. If everything I've read is true, I'd be very dissapointed if they cheapened the series with a 3rd season. Basically, the resolution in my opinion, is the two dues' merging in the end. That is the metaphor for marriage / procreation / making kids. That is what creates the new city at the end and resets everything. Cause the city is the new pyschi of a child. Without memories. We spend our life without memory of why we are on this earth. Then, the solution is, that we have kids. Then those kids follow the same path of trying to discover for themselves their missing "memories" of purpose. The show came full circle at the end of season 2 from what i see.

I disagree season 2 i tohught would suck, but in my opinion it was better than season one, THEY HAVE VERY GOOD WRITERS and not american work ethics so they write good. I think season 3 would roxor!


It really depends on ratings

I believe that a season 3 would be great because the ending left an opening. I think that Clockwork tomatos season 3 is great becuase of what Angel does for the people. Stops the events from happening but leaves their memories. That keeps a "The-Event-like-situation" from occuring over and over wich leaves the possiblity for more of a story line building senario.

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Originally posted by Paradigm Dog I haven't read every single post here, but I want to say this (forgive me if it's been said). Your theory is a very good and unique one to be sure, however, while taking a Psychology course one could say this is "Sigmund Freud" at work. However, one could just as easily say this is a show of religious metaphor dealing with the Book of Revelation, and in that case, it is not at the end yet. Notice the BIG's colors same as the Four Horseman.(just one of MANY examples that have gone through these forums before...there are literally hundreds of posts on the connections to the Bible, more so than Freud). I have a strong feeling the writers have more up their sleeve to this, and are merely awaiting the money to finish up this epic properly with an additional 26. I eagerly await that day. The ending shows that Roger has failed. The RESET has occured again, but the main point has not changed. The memories are still gone. I understand what your saying, but I don't beleive that was the main point of this show. There was something that triggered this need for a RESET long ago. Because we have memories of a shining, spick-and-span Paradigm in Roger the Wanderer, and a world half in ruin the whole series and after the RESET of episode 26...buildings are still fallen over, etc. Each RESET, something changes, man moves toward an ultimate goal and conflict. For instance, think of the past Rogers who have failed their mission--they died fighting in a war (what of them, there bodies are still present in the sea along with destroyed Megadei). There is evident build up toward a climax here, but the mastermind of Paradigm, whether it be Angel or someone else, is not allowing the resolution/ the final judgement to occur yet. Until man breaks the cycle, man will be a slave to a devil (angel?) basically, forcing them to live repressed lives of uncertainty. This world is in a Tribulation of sorts...not nessessarily biblical, but along those lines it seems. You can't end a series totally properly with the future holding darkness and endless destruction of the same pattern over and over again. Gordon was quite clear he hired Roger to neogotiate in the past wit hthe creator, and he did not succeed, thus the need for the last RESET, but this time, despite Rogers efforts and gaining some ground evidently (as Angel and Dorothy are shown in the end of 26 now on the side of the road) he failed. He did not recover the memories, which was his purpose--Paradigm is still lost in twisted Amnesia as seen at the end of 26. We have no idea who Roger is yet, what's the connection of the lesser Domini like Benny w/ Osrail, the cause of the first Event and first RESET, etc. So much unanswered, too much to even remember really. Roger must continue on and COMPLETE his neogotiations. The series is meant for a Season 3 I beleive.

I disagree that he "failed", to a certain degree. Those last few seconds in the final episode seem to convey a change. Maybe it's going to take more time to perfect everything, but Roger has fulfilled his purpose in moving things along.

So he's failed in the sense that Paradigm City is a city of amnesia, but it's getting closer and closer to being the real thing, the real tomato.

Showing us an absolutely real reality isn't necessary as long as we see that things are moving toward it, that there was a reason why we just watched 26 episodes of the show.

OMGWTFTOMATO!!!11one

Anyway, I have mixed feelings about the possibility of Season 3. On one hand, you can find finality in the ending provided if you think a certain way, but on the other hand, it leaves a certain emptiness.

Plus, more Angel can't be bad.

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Originally posted by Big Waddle quote: Originally posted by Paradigm Dog I haven't read every single post here, but I want to say this (forgive me if it's been said). Your theory is a very good and unique one to be sure, however, while taking a Psychology course one could say this is "Sigmund Freud" at work. However, one could just as easily say this is a show of religious metaphor dealing with the Book of Revelation, and in that case, it is not at the end yet. Notice the BIG's colors same as the Four Horseman.(just one of MANY examples that have gone through these forums before...there are literally hundreds of posts on the connections to the Bible, more so than Freud). I have a strong feeling the writers have more up their sleeve to this, and are merely awaiting the money to finish up this epic properly with an additional 26. I eagerly await that day. The ending shows that Roger has failed. The RESET has occured again, but the main point has not changed. The memories are still gone. I understand what your saying, but I don't beleive that was the main point of this show. There was something that triggered this need for a RESET long ago. Because we have memories of a shining, spick-and-span Paradigm in Roger the Wanderer, and a world half in ruin the whole series and after the RESET of episode 26...buildings are still fallen over, etc. Each RESET, something changes, man moves toward an ultimate goal and conflict. For instance, think of the past Rogers who have failed their mission--they died fighting in a war (what of them, there bodies are still present in the sea along with destroyed Megadei). There is evident build up toward a climax here, but the mastermind of Paradigm, whether it be Angel or someone else, is not allowing the resolution/ the final judgement to occur yet. Until man breaks the cycle, man will be a slave to a devil (angel?) basically, forcing them to live repressed lives of uncertainty. This world is in a Tribulation of sorts...not nessessarily biblical, but along those lines it seems. You can't end a series totally properly with the future holding darkness and endless destruction of the same pattern over and over again. Gordon was quite clear he hired Roger to neogotiate in the past wit hthe creator, and he did not succeed, thus the need for the last RESET, but this time, despite Rogers efforts and gaining some ground evidently (as Angel and Dorothy are shown in the end of 26 now on the side of the road) he failed. He did not recover the memories, which was his purpose--Paradigm is still lost in twisted Amnesia as seen at the end of 26. We have no idea who Roger is yet, what's the connection of the lesser Domini like Benny w/ Osrail, the cause of the first Event and first RESET, etc. So much unanswered, too much to even remember really. Roger must continue on and COMPLETE his neogotiations. The series is meant for a Season 3 I beleive. I disagree that he "failed", to a certain degree. Those last few seconds in the final episode seem to convey a change. Maybe it's going to take more time to perfect everything, but Roger has fulfilled his purpose in moving things along. So he's failed in the sense that Paradigm City is a city of amnesia, but it's getting closer and closer to being the real thing, the real tomato. Showing us an absolutely real reality isn't necessary as long as we see that things are moving toward it, that there was a reason why we just watched 26 episodes of the show. OMGWTFTOMATO!!!11one Anyway, I have mixed feelings about the possibility of Season 3. On one hand, you can find finality in the ending provided if you think a certain way, but on the other hand, it leaves a certain emptiness. Plus, more Angel can't be bad.

my eyes hurt so im not reading all of that right now, but "we have come to terms" means negotiation successful

I consider season 2 a linear story written based on the premise of season 1. Hence the name Big O II.

Hey, everyone. My first post here... exciting.

Anyway, about the show actually needing to be cut off after 26 eps, I disagree. It's obvious from the too classic "ah, it's starting over!" ending that the writers viewed act 26 as a kind of finale, and I have a hard time guessing where they'd go from here with what they have, but the fact is that Big O hasn't done a whole lot. Well, at least not a whole lot of what it potentially can.

Think about it. We've only had 26 episodes. That's really not a lot. Act 26 just gave us a half-forced ending to a series that hasn't finished telling all its stories. clericblackdave, your issue seems to be with the fact that Big O has come to metaphorical/philosophical completion, but I'd say that the show is more about characters facing the weird metaphorical/philosophical wonderland that is paradigm city than the philosophy itself.

One could argue that Roger's arc has been finished (the last few eps seemed like one big monolouge from him at times), but Dorothy and Angel? I also can't imagine the writers just threw Norman in there *only* to be batman's alfred with giant guns. He has an ep a season in him at least.


Oh, and a couple other things

I've always interpreted the "meaning" of Big O as being just a general existentialist view on life. It seemed like Roger was always saying something that could roughly translate to "Man, all these loose ends and contradictions are really mind-blowing, but my actions are all that matter!" Someone will really have to point me in the direction of a thread that looks at all the religious elements in the show though.

What's this about use of "we have come to terms" and "no side" being a standard anime convention? I always assumed it was specific to this show and due to Roger being a negotiator. Now *that's* more mind-blowing than any tv series ending could be.

and, dude, come on. don't bash the west or America (at least not me specifically). just because our animation has been really sub-par for a good many years doesn't mean our culture is so bankrupt that it has prevented us from appreciating ambigiuous endings to TV shows. I can appreciate The Prisoner; I can appreciate Big O.

Anyway, sorry, long post.

I completely agree with vickiwinters. There are way too many loose ends. I believ at the end of a show you should wrap up every main character's story up. Too many questions were left unanswered. Such as, What is with Danstun's looping life, and why doesn't it happen with anyone else. How is it Dorthy can work without her Main processor? Where does Beck's memories come from? I want answers and a third season could-no-should give us those answers.

As fans we deserve more answers than this, at least I do. I would also like to see, the apperance of a super duper villian such as: I don't know. . .Maybe another DOMINUS!

I don't think he meant literally that an anime tends to end with "We Have Come To Terms" but instead, that they end with a tag line. For example, "See You Space Cowboy." And then they sometimes have variations on it. For example: "Merry X-Mas" after Daemonseed or "See You Space Samurai" after Cowboy Funk.

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Originally posted by Stampede I don't think he meant literally that an anime tends to end with "We Have Come To Terms" but instead, that they end with a tag line. For example, "See You Space Cowboy." And then they sometimes have variations on it. For example: "Merry X-Mas" after Daemonseed or "See You Space Samurai" after Cowboy Funk.

Not all animes have that, though. Many might have "To Be Continued", but I've only seen a couple where there's a tagline. Namely Big O and Cowboy Bebop, both of which were done by the same studio.

But anyhow, there's more than enough still to talk about in the show for a third season to take place. The last few episodes asked as many questions as they answered, and the only way to answer them is more episodes! The ending indicates the city continues to exist, so the mystery continues. Thus, we need more!

Besides, I want to see Big O trash more Megadei and monsters, darnit!