Discuss the Current Episode

Pythagoras 05-23-2004 03:02 AM
I just happened to catch the series tonight. I was surprised to see ep one was on again. That bodes well to me for a third season.

Anyway, was I the only one who noticed that Dastun seems to sound a bit different?
Randolph 05-23-2004 03:16 AM
I had been noticing that Dastun's voice was quite different from what it was during the second half.
This, I think, can be attributed to that when Dastun talks, he's most often agitated or downright shouting out of excitement. The scene in which he was speaking with Roger was when he was at his most relaxed in the entire series, so I expect that may have had something to do with it.

And about Big O's hand... Roger appraoched him from the right, so it only made sense for him to pick up Roger with his right hand. I really don't think that Big O has a "handedness" of his own. I think he just imitates Roger, who is right-handed.
Wingnut 05-23-2004 08:16 AM
There is also a pan that seems to have been overlooked in Act 1. It is very quickly done and the cation it covers distracts from the pan itself. It is when Dastun calls Roger Lt. Smith, then Roger slams down the shot glass and we quickly pan diagnoly up to his face and he warns Dastun that he is pushing it.
BabyGhia 05-23-2004 04:07 PM
Act 1 of Big O!

I was gonna mention all the stuff the ACT did so I'll spare you the repeat.

But I love how giddy Roger gets when he finds that a women is waiting for him upstairs. He's just so giddy! Straightens his tie... Makes sure that he looks good. And then the disappointment on his face (I don't think it's all because of Dorothy but a bit to do with the fact that he was SO attracted to her the first time he saw her and he can't understand why he was.). And then the cute little interplay with Roger and Dorothy. The perfect line of "You're such a louse, Roger Smith."

[edit: I worded that a little strangely. I'm a little rushed at the moment. I'll revisit it later.]

Great episode!

Side note: I was just so happy to see it back on the air. I didn't realize that I had missed it so. It's different watching it on TV than on DVD or on tapes.

BabyGhia
Son_of_Horus 05-23-2004 04:30 PM
I liked the "coldness" of Dorothy toward Miguel Saldano's death.. "She refers to Saldano's last words as the, "ramblings of a dying man."

Then she almost seems to mock Rogers reverence when he begins to pray...

"What are you doing? Praying?"

She's really snotty at first.

Roger even refers to Dorothy 1 as a spoiled rich girl before he chest thumps it.
(So we know who he was really thinking about)

Let the sexual frustration begin!
Big Grin
Zopwx2 05-23-2004 06:03 PM
Episode 1 really did a good job of conveying atmosphere.

The industrial sector, the mansion, and out of all the episodes, I still feel episode one was the best episode at convincing me how massive the megadeii are.

The detail in the steps as he smashes a phone booth, dorothy one scraping a building, the slow fight.

And the piston punch. I forgot how great this fight was.
Dork 05-23-2004 06:18 PM
I love these first episodes. Esspecially the Dorothy-development aspect.

Dorothy, throughout the series is very much a child. She may look 18, have the vocabulary and conversational skills (for the most part) of an 18-year-old but she's so child-like. As I never seem to tire of mentioning her father did not do a good job of 'raising' her and pretty much stunted her emotional growth.

She's stunted to such a point that as of act 1 she still hasn't developed abstract thought, or the ability to sympathize with her fellow sentient-lifeforms, (Abstract thought is something children aren't really capable of until age 11 or 12) thus her rather callus reaction to Soldano's death. But she does get better at sympathizing with people fairly quickly starting with act 6 -I love that her concern for Instro causes such confussion for her Pleased - and it fully developes in act 8 when Dorothy gets her kitty Big Grin

Really, she's an emotional two-year-old. She never quite grows up through-out the series (not that that's a bad thing, and anyhow, who's going to grow-up completely over the course of only 7 to 9 months?), but she also seems to have a better understanding of the true nature of Paradigm than anybody else (aside from *maybe* Angel and Gorden at the very end of act 26). She's just a fascinating character, she knows so much but she's so young that she's really not that interested in what it all means.

anywho, back to 'Roger the Negotiator'
-----------------------------

This episode and 'Dorothy Dorothy' together make my favorite episode of the series. But I had trouble watching it the first few times because Roger was such a jerk. At no point in the series is Roger as much of an ass as he is in the first episode. He is cockiness personified in this episode. But this episode not only introduces Roger, it also introduces Dorothy and Dorothy helps to make Roger likeable. I do like that Roger's suppose to be a jerk. It's such a relief after watching Batman. Bruce wasn't suppose to come off as a jerk (as far as I remember) and, I dunno, that just made me hate him. Roger's a rich young guy with a fast car and kick-ass Megadeus, even dispite his principles and his best efforts he's going to come off as a jerk from time to time.

Dorothy sometimes makes Roger too likeable, and one thing I really love about this series is that just when Roger's starting to feel like too much of a perfect guy the writers pull away and remind the audience that he's still a rich, impudent young man. The most notable example, I think, is in act 19 when Roger flings his business card at the woman at Paradigm Central office.

I guess I've kinda gotten desentisized to Roger's jerk nature in act 1, I barely notice it anymore. Or perhaps I've just been distracted by Roger's hands,. . . those big, beautiful hands, nothing like those horrible stick fingers we see in season two. Oh, no, Roger's hands in act 1 are fully articulated, honest to god, all american man-hands. In season two the animators really seem to enjoy exaggerating Roger's chest. Which is all well and good if you're a ten-year-old in love with spandex superheros; but, as a girl I think that if you have to exaggerate anything then, for the love of flying megadeuses everywhere, exaggerate the hands!

This episode has the best animation of the entire series. Not even the later half of the two-parter, 'Dorothy Dorothy', can match the sophisticated, 1920s elegance of 'Roger the Negotiator'. I'd love to know how much this episode cost to make compared to your average season two (or even season one) episode. The animation, truely, is on a whole other level. Even if the story wasn't as moody, laid back, and wonderfully well-paced as it is I'd still watch this episode over and over again for no other reason than to watch Roger's fluid motions.

Roger has these few, not even scenes, more like moments when his movements are simply, I don't know,. . . forgive me, but the only word I can think of is 'orgasmic'. There's the first time he gets out of the car, which is more cool than anything else, it doesn't really give any sense of his character. I think what I like more is when he hands, more like flings, his tie to Norman. There's a wonderful flippancy in the movement, in less than a second you know he has this natural masculine grace, he's a man, who even if he wasn't born wealthy, was born to be wealthy. He wears his affulance so well, which you can also see in the tie movement, along with a pure, deep-seated self-involvment.

The third of these fluid movements (and I think the last in this episode) is my favorite. It's 2 actions instead of one, all in about a 5 second time scale. Action 1, Roger yanks at his tie to loosen it, action 2, he plots down on the couch, flings his arm out and hooks it around the back of the couch. It's a fantastic precursor to Roger and Dorothy's relationship. The movement is part guinuine disappointment that the 'lady guest' is, in actuality, an android but also part over-kill. Roger's uses as familar language with Dorothy as his character is capable of, all of his actions and reactions are very exaggerated. While we don't really get any indication that Roger cares one thing or another for Dorothy until the very end of the episode, with this scene you get the feeling that he's trying to cover something up.

There is some sort of spark between those two when they first meet, I still don't quite know why. They both feel it. Dorothy pretty much falls in love at first sight, and while Roger highly resists it he's still affected by the same spark.

spoilers for act 26:
spoiler (highlight to read):
Perhaps this is a result of the reset? Let's say for arguments' sake that Roger fell in love with her before the last reset. Could a remnant of those feelings have carried over even with his memory erased?


Roger is one of my favorite protagionists of all time. A near perfect combination of negative and possitive traits that together create one hell of a likeable character.

Great episode. Can't wait for next week! 'Dorothy Dorothy'!


muchlove
-dork
YZEtc 05-23-2004 07:43 PM
I, too, was glad to hear that The Big O was back on TV, so what better way to celebrate than by cracking open my The Big O - The Complete Collection season 1 DVDs and jotting down a few comments, eh?
Although I've watched this episode enough times to practically know it by heart, I still get a kick out of this episode #1, which is still my personal favorite.


They say that first impressions are crucial in a relationship, and what is "Mister Knight in Shining Armor" 's first impression of his "Damsel in Distress" once he gets a good look at her, minus blindfold?

"Aaaaaahh!..."

I take that to be a favorable review...until, of course, ol' Bullethead pulls the plug on our Negotiator's brief mid-day fantasy by rather bluntly informing him that he'd just been aroused by an android.

I bet Roger hates it when that happens.
And, this is no mean feat, I'd say, because anything that results in him whipping off his cool shades that quickly is something to make you sit up and take notice

Not surprising, then, that after he loses the ransom money, has his client call him an incompetent idiot, and perhaps wonders to himself if he needs an eye exam, he is suddenly jolted back to life once he returns home after a hard day's work and hears his stalwart butler utter those magical words that can brighten even the most disasterous and gloomy of days:

"There's a woman in da house."

Or words to that effect.

But, this is definately not a good day for Roger's male ego, because after he hurriedly puts his tie back on, scuttles out of the elevator impatiently, and lays eyes on the shapely silhouette waiting by the window as he ascends the flight of stairs leading up to his Let's Get Acquainted floor, he opens the conversation by laying on the charm with a trowel, letting his guest know beyond any doubt that she is a member of an elite group of people that are allowed entry into those hallowed halls.

Her reaction?
Whirrrrrrrr...

His?
Claiming Norman must be senile for mistaking her for a woman.

She deals with this insult in a fitting manner - by reminding Paradigm's top Negotiator that he couldn't tell, earlier, either, and he was standing nose-to-nose gawking at her on top of that.

Chalk another one up for Miss. Wayneright.

After that, it's time to loosen the tie and match wits, which will set the tone of their relationship for the forseeable future:
The Slick, Ravenous Negotiator vs. the Sharp-Tounged, Pretty Android.

Good stuff.
R and D 05-23-2004 08:24 PM
ahhh the famous line of the whole series...

"You are a louse, Roger Smith."

It gives me tears of happiness everytime i hear it. *sniff* Crying

I can't believe it's on Saturdays now. Well, bring out the popcorn and soda and let's party! Big Grin Cool Anime Smile Pleased Tongue Smile ) Wink
LoveFool71 05-24-2004 07:30 AM
I'm so glad to see they put Big-O back on, and at 11:30 where I'm at! I love this episode, tons of Dorothy in it, and the best scene with her is when she turns to look up at Roger, after Soldano points her out to him. Take a good look Roger Smith, you won't find any better! Ah I love it!
Madrona 05-25-2004 11:57 AM
A few comment about you comments:
quote:
.Dorothy sometimes makes Roger too likeable, and one thing I really love about this series is that just when Roger's starting to feel like too much of a perfect guy the writers pull away and remind the audience that he's still a rich, impudent young man. The most notable example, I think, is in act 19 when Roger flings his business card at the woman at Paradigm Central office.


Dork, you have to remember that it's Dorothy's situation that has him all worked up in the first place here.
quote:
but, as a girl I think that if you have to exaggerate anything then, for the love of flying megadeuses everywhere, exaggerate the hands!

Oh Yes!!.

So, since we're starting all over again, I'm keeping a running tab of how many questions that Roger asks that Dorothy never answers. This bugs me through the whole series.
A Clockwork Tomato 05-25-2004 01:12 PM
quote:
Originally posted by madrona
So, since we're starting all over again, I'm keeping a running tab of how many questions that Roger asks that Dorothy never answers. This bugs me through the whole series.


Dorothy's speech patterns are fascinating. Her speech is very expressive when she feels like it, but she rarely feels like it. She almost never uses speech unnecessarily.

She can be counted upon to resent personal questions or over-familiarity. Thus, she instantly responds to "Do I have to make you get out?" with "YOu can try, but I doubt a mere human would have the strength." And when Soldano calls her his daughter, she slaps him down in a very similar manner with "He assembled me from blueprints, nothing more" (or words to that effect).

But she often slaps Roger down with silence, instead.

What fascinates me about this is the obvious emotional content in these actions. Dorothy is annoyed by personal questions, upset by any line of questioning that ties her to Soldano or Wayneright, fearful of her Megadeus connection, and exasperated by Roger's failure to accept her as an attractive woman. She shows no sign at all of being coldly logical. She ISN'T coldly logical.

Her silence may be a way of avoiding the necessity of lying in conversation. If lying is very difficult, your choices basically boil down to being very open, very closed, or incoherent. Dorothy takes the "closed" option and says little.
Atropos 05-25-2004 11:20 PM
New Big O fans in our midst? Quite possibly...

I didn't even know Big O was coming back on until I caught the tail-end of it when I turned the TV on for Bebop Saturday. My brother had been wanting to watch the series (after my interest in it sparked HIS interest), but AdultSwim had taken it off before he got a chance to. So, after I told him it was airing on Saturdays, he immediately set up a tape to catch the second showing of it. We just sat down and watched it yesterday, and my OTHER brother joined, too, since he was in the room at the time (he likes Asimov a lot, so the references there sparked his interest).

Well, of course the "You're a louse, Roger Smith," had them laughing. Smile When the end came around and the screen went to "To Be Continued" one of them let out this very disappointed groan/grunt type noise while the other exclaimed, "DAMN IT! Now I'm going to have to wait an entire WEEK until I can find out what happens! They'd BETTER put this on weekdays again, otherwise I won't be able to handle it!"

So who knows, maybe in a couple months a new member or two who are related to me will drop in. Wink
Dork 05-25-2004 11:26 PM
That's great, Atropos.

Although if I'd only been able to watch one eppie of Big O a week I would have caved and bought the box set a lot sooner than I had. Then again, I'm obsessive.

Glad you were able to hook more people, it's always so nice when you can do that Big Grin


muchlove
-dork
LoveFool71 05-26-2004 08:23 AM
quote:
Glad you were able to hook more people, it's always so nice when you can do that


Yea, I got my wife and daughter hooked on it, especially my wife, the looks on her face when the battle scenes erupt are priceless. My daughter will stay up to see Big-O on Saturday, but she can only see certain eps. and like last Saturday, there were a couple of scenes where I had to cover her eyes and ears! Yep quality fam time!
Dork 05-26-2004 11:23 AM
quote:
Originally posted by LoveFool71
quote:
Glad you were able to hook more people, it's always so nice when you can do that


Yea, I got my wife and daughter hooked on it, especially my wife, the looks on her face when the battle scenes erupt are priceless. My daughter will stay up to see Big-O on Saturday, but she can only see certain eps. and like last Saturday, there were a couple of scenes where I had to cover her eyes and ears! Yep quality fam time!


How old is your daughter?

I don't know how much of the series you've seen so far but just for fair warning you should prolly be careful about act 8, 'Missing Cat'. It's the sweetest episode of the series but also the most violent.
LoveFool71 05-26-2004 11:57 AM
She's 5 and she has seen ep. 8 right up to where we see Dorothy walk down the steps with Pero, but thats it. Let's see, theres only two episodes that I think are for fam viewing ep. 11 (minus the nutty Santa scene) and 18 (minus Beck's potty mouth).
Dork 05-26-2004 12:17 PM
Yeah, I think you're right. There's not many episodes that are appropriate for children. I guess I forget that sometimes because Big O's the tamest show on Adult Swim (sans Conan). But I wouldn't let my little cousins watch this show. Heck, I'm over-protective, I wouldn't let my cousins watch Sailor Moon.

There are quite a few episodes that I don't think have objectionable material in them (Hydra, I think might be one of them) but they wouldn't be much fun for a child (Hydra again).
Madrona 05-26-2004 04:16 PM
quote:
Originally posted by A Clockwork Tomato

Her silence may be a way of avoiding the necessity of lying in conversation. If lying is very difficult, your choices basically boil down to being very open, very closed, or incoherent. Dorothy takes the "closed" option and says little.


I thought for a while that it means she knows more about the past than she is letting on. So instead of lying as you say, she says nothing. But I like your explaination better. Big Grin

quote:
She's 5 and she has seen ep. 8 right up to where we see Dorothy walk down the steps with Pero, but thats it. Let's see, theres only two episodes that I think are for fam viewing ep. 11 (minus the nutty Santa scene) and 18 (minus Beck's potty mouth).


My daughter turns 8 in July and I have reservations about letting her watch it. She's seen bits and pieces but not the whole thing. She knows the characters and she knows why I like Roger Smith(hey, she's 7, not stupid!) She's begging, but I have to convince the hubby who has not watched it at all. He's sort of refusing because I like it SOOOO much.
C.R Foxhound 05-26-2004 04:54 PM
quote:
Originally posted by madrona
but I have to convince the hubby who has not watched it at all. He's sort of refusing because I like it SOOOO much.



I think he's jelous of Roger, then again, what guy isnt