Episode 26 Discussion: "The Show Must Go On"

Perhaps "our" Paradigm was not to find Angel but Roger?
Think about it, we see Roger the Negotiator, Roger the Wanderer, and finally, Roger the Tomato. I'm thinking when Dorothy says to the real Angel "Roger the Negotiator", maybe she means that's his choice of who he thinks he should be?

Bah, regardless, I'm still a wee confoosed. ME WANT DVD EXTRAS THAT EXPLAIN THIS INSANITY!!!

re: why did Dorothy call him a louse this time? I thought it was because okay, she saved his ass, and then he asks for mouth to mouth, as in, "honey, I could have used a kiss right about then." It took him this long to finally come around to hitting on her, damn right he's a louse. But then, she's right by his side to the end.

All I can say is, this keeps the door open for Season Three. I mean, how many times have you seen shows *cough BEBOP, TRIGUN cough* where you say, oh man, they can't have much of a sequel there, too many cool characters died in the last episode! But Roger Smith in the city of Amnesia! What a great opening! Is Dorothy human at last? Is Angel in control of this reality, or is it someone else's turn? Is Roger going to finally get with Dorothy, or does everyone have amnesia and the big dope is going to have to take twenty-plus episodes to figure out he loves her after all?

Bring it on, bring it on: the Cowboy is waiting!

BECK!!!
HE KNEW IT!! BWHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAAA!!!!! @___@
*has gone insane*

...THEY'RE COMING TO TAKE ME AWAY HA HAA!! THEY'rE COMING TO TAKE ME AWAY HO HOO HEEE HHEEEEE HAHAAA!!!!!! BWHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAA!!!! BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAAAHAAAAHAAAAA!!!!!!

*drops unconscious before typing extremely long and informative post*

@.@

quote:

Or am I just remembering things that never happened (again)?

Well you know what Gordon Rosewater said about memories...

Personally, I'm rather sceptical about a Season 3. But then maybe they'll pull it off.

Well, I decided to hold off on posting here until I rewatched it again (I taped it).


Couple of observations, mixed in with my thoughts.

Gordon knew what was coming... his dialogue to Angel in the elevator was future tense... indicating that whoever was in charge could write things as they pleased and even to a point where nothing had existed 40 years prior (as opposed to a cataclysmic event).

Angel gets off the elevator realzing that Gordon was referring to *her*

Gordon wishes Roger the negotiator luck as well after Angel disappears. Meaning, it's up to Roger to negotiate with God as to exactly what form the rewrite takes at this point.

Roger realizes that Angel is the one responsible for Big Venus or *is Venus* - that is - Angel the memory, not necessarily Angel the director. (I'm making the distinction because Angel is watching BIg Venus negotiate with Roger as well as all the other assorted moments. Did you notice that on the other screens that there were other Roger/Angel moments? hrm..)

Roger negotiates with ANgel - telling her essentially that he chose to not remember things... and I think saying that the people *all chose* to not remember things and essentially that in the reset not to release all memories (which was one of the things Gordon told her in the elevator that was within her power).

Roger also tells her that she *can be human*... and says a couple of nice things to Angel. (awww.)

Anyways - the reset shows me that to some degree Roger succeeded. She reset the world with Roger as negotiator once again, and with some form of herself in it.

My guess is if Roger was completely successful... that some things might be exactly the same, or differ.

What those differences might be is something I'd like to see in another season. OR a completely self-contained prequel .

And I'm trying to attach the poster that appears at teh very end behind Roger and Dorothy (it is on the inside of the anime book, underneath the paper cover) but it looks like it isn't working.

• Attachment: bkpost2.jpg

quote:

Originally posted by evanASF27 BECK!!! HE KNEW IT!! BWHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAAA!!!!! @___@ *has gone insane* ...THEY'RE COMING TO TAKE ME AWAY HA HAA!! THEY'rE COMING TO TAKE ME AWAY HO HOO HEEE HHEEEEE HAHAAA!!!!!! BWHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAA!!!! BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAAAHAAAAHAAAAA!!!!!! *drops unconscious before typing extremely long and informative post* @.@

You know, back on Anime Jump and before season 2, I posted a theory about Beck being more important than anyone thought. That theory was rejected by many of the members there. While I focused on R-D and whatnot in my theory, I was RIGHT ANYWAY!!! MWAAHAHAH!

I humbly submit that the new director is Dorothy.

She has changed her role. She has transcended her previous existence. She has a consciousness that exists outside of her memories (as graphically demonstrated by her "rising from the dead" in Roger's mansion). And the last words we hear from the control room are Dorothy saying, "Roger. The Negotiator." Which are followed in rapid order by the reloop.

Guess we need a Season 3 to find out!

I don't know if anyone else went digging for their DVD, but I sure did!

When they show the begining again, there's a shot of Angel and R. Dorthory standing on the side of the road as Roger drives by. Both dressed in black. This is different from the first episode where the first time we see Dorthory is when Roger goes to negotiate her freedom from Beck, and she is in green. And we won't see Angel for quite some time yet...

So it's not exactly the same, which means the timeline may be just different enough for season three to be feasable...


That's just my way of looking at it though.

quote:

Originally posted by Penny Century I humbly submit that the new director is Dorothy. Guess we need a Season 3 to find out!

Well the director who created the world we'd see in Season 3 (assuming we don't go backwards) is clearly Angel Rosewater ...a nd the book is now completed. I'm not entirely sure if that means that the world can be reset again at all if Angel truly is the real creator.

Then again, who knows? bleah.

And yay... it looked like my attachment worked!

quote:

Originally posted by hyge I don't know if anyone else went digging for their DVD, but I sure did! When they show the begining again, there's a shot of Angel and R. Dorthory standing on the side of the road as Roger drives by. Both dressed in black. This is different from the first episode where the first time we see Dorthory is when Roger goes to negotiate her freedom from Beck, and she is in green. And we won't see Angel for quite some time yet... So it's not exactly the same, which means the timeline may be just different enough for season three to be feasable... That's just my way of looking at it though.

You forgot one more change. Most overlooked it actually in Megadeus's spoiler clips: the manhole plate sound is different.

Ok here is my theory on y they didn't kiss/ mouth to mouth!

• when Roger confessed may be she wasn't totally out of it and heard it causing her to think you didn't want me then so y do you want me now!
  

ahahah o well thats my guess

I have a really crazy theory but I have to put it down because I'm hoping as I'm going through it it will either cease to make sense or it will click perfectly.

First, I don't think there was a rewind. I think Roger stopped Angel from completing the rewind. Paradigm is still the city without the memory of what happened forty years ago because even Angel doesn't understand that yet.

What I think is that Gordon sacrificed himself so Angel could complete the circle. She is the embodiment of what was forty years ago- although she doesn't remember it. Roger convinced her to live as a person instead of as Big Venus- to go in search of herself as Angel instead of destroying Paradigm City. I don't think that the Megadeus in Roger's memory of the destruction of Paradigm 40 years ago is Big Venus.

When Dorothy said "Roger the Negiotiator" to Angel I think that signaled that Roger had convinced Angel and that she should trust in him.

So what could be covered in Season three, you ask? Angel, Roger, and Dorothy still have no clue who they are. Datsun finally controls a Police Force that's good for something. Who did write Metropolis? Was it Angel? Was it someone who created Angel? Is she human? Was she protected from the apocolipse of 40 years ago? Who created Dorothy? Could it be that she and the Big O were sent to Roger, albeit for different purposes? Could there be two realities?

Then again, I could be crazy. This is probably what CN was trying to accomplish.

I'm going to bed now.

quote:

Originally posted by hyge I don't know if anyone else went digging for their DVD, but I sure did! When they show the begining again, there's a shot of Angel and R. Dorthory standing on the side of the road as Roger drives by. Both dressed in black. This is different from the first episode where the first time we see Dorthory is when Roger goes to negotiate her freedom from Beck, and she is in green. And we won't see Angel for quite some time yet... So it's not exactly the same, which means the timeline may be just different enough for season three to be feasable... That's just my way of looking at it though.

well, you've got dorothy in black right, but angel is wearing her pink outfit....also they both look a bit different

quote:

Originally posted by hyge I don't know if anyone else went digging for their DVD, but I sure did! When they show the begining again, there's a shot of Angel and R. Dorthory standing on the side of the road as Roger drives by. So it's not exactly the same, which means the timeline may be just different enough for season three to be feasable... That's just my way of looking at it though.

actually, some of us discussed this in a previous thread (since we had seen parts of ep 26 already).

There are other things "missing." Namely Roger's watch or rather the reflection of his watch on his shades!

There is something else that bothers me a little bit. I thought the translation on the Japanese BigO site of Roger's final line differed somewhat. Could someone go back and watch the Japanese version ? I thought Roger had stated "My job as negotiator is complete."

Well, the ending was indeed confusing. It would have been nice to have more answers to things like... How come Dorothy could move? I'm thinking maybe she has a memory back up inside Big O and somehow it got activated but... eh I want to know you know not just make guesses.

Haha I loved the part where Roger suggested "mouth to mouth"
and btw Dorothy doesn't call Roger a louse in the Japanese version. She said you'd regret what you said if I lost air pressure or whatever. I think Dorothy didn't do it because she couldn't.

For me Big O's final attack was the best part of the episode besides Dorothy's moment on Roger's lap.

Yes I want Season 3...there are many things that could be developed and explored. I just can't help wanting more but I won't complain if there isn't a Season 3 because I'm thankful there was a Season 2.

It repeats at 2:00am.

quote:

Originally posted by s-girl quote: Originally posted by hyge I don't know if anyone else went digging for their DVD, but I sure did! When they show the begining again, there's a shot of Angel and R. Dorthory standing on the side of the road as Roger drives by. So it's not exactly the same, which means the timeline may be just different enough for season three to be feasable... That's just my way of looking at it though. actually, some of us discussed this in a previous thread (since we had seen parts of ep 26 already). There are other things "missing." Namely Roger's watch or rather the reflection of his watch on his shades! There is something else that bothers me a little bit. I thought the translation on the Japanese BigO site of Roger's final line differed somewhat. Could someone go back and watch the Japanese version ? I thought Roger had stated "My job as negotiator is complete."

I just listened to it in Japanese and Roger speaks in the ongoing tense... "My name is Roger Smith I do a much needed job in this City of amnesia". Just his usual line.

quote:

Originally posted by Chibi DorothyI just listened to it in Japanese and Roger speaks in the ongoing tense... "My name is Roger Smith I do a much needed job in this City of amnesia". Just his usual line.

Thanks for the doublecheck. I also went back and rewatched that line in episode 1 and listened to the Japanese version. It is literally the same, although the music underscoring is new and there to give closure to that line.

But that watch is gone... darn it... what can it all mean? :-) Does Roger have Big O in this continuity or nOT?

waaah!