Roger Smith's Age

Larry99 01-06-2007 06:49 PM
How old is Roger Smith? He helped make Paradigm City with Gordon Rosewater. Young enough to date Dorothy. Has memories of events prior to 40 years ago (correct me if I am wrong). Knows Alex Rosewater is a "tomato." Let me know what you think.
SEELE 08 01-06-2007 07:55 PM
He's 25 and don't ask what he is because that is more debated than the End of Evangelion.
Nine Kuze 01-07-2007 12:29 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Larry99
How old is Roger Smith? He helped make Paradigm City with Gordon Rosewater. Young enough to date Dorothy. Has memories of events prior to 40 years ago (correct me if I am wrong). Knows Alex Rosewater is a "tomato." Let me know what you think.

Yeah, he's 25 but it sounds like you are getting the Roger Smith that is followed and presented throughout the entire series with that of the Roger Smith that has been shown in other various forms (such as Gordon's picture and supposedly, Angel's memories in Act 26). Also, does Roger actually know that Alex is just another tomato like himself? I know it was shown that Alex wasn't actually "the son of the king" (Gordon's birth child) but I don't think that Roger knowing this was actually hinted at during the series.

Also, I think R.Dorothy was modeled after the human Dorothy at the age of 18 so yeah.

quote:
Originally posted by SEELE 08
He's 25 and don't ask what he is because that is more debated than the End of Evangelion.

What? He's a human. Stop with the flashback (that wasn't supposed to be taken literal) reference.

Also, what's so debated about EOE? It kind of makes sense to me is all.
Peace.
The Baker St. Irregular 01-07-2007 12:35 AM
They say he's 25, but I irrationally refuse to believe it. GRUMBLE GRUMBLE GRUMBLECAKES. He does not look or behave like a 25 year old anime character.
Nine Kuze 01-07-2007 12:40 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Mistress-Samwise
He does not look or behave like a 25 year old anime character.

Well Mistress, in that logic, couldn't you say that the entire series of The Big O doesn't look or behave like a generic anime series in itself?

Because to be honest, it quite doesn't.
Peace.
The Baker St. Irregular 01-07-2007 12:52 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Nine XXVI
quote:
Originally posted by Mistress-Samwise
He does not look or behave like a 25 year old anime character.

Well Mistress, in that logic, couldn't you say that the entire series of The Big O doesn't look or behave like a generic anime series in itself?

Because to be honest, it quite doesn't.
Peace.


Obviously, a plus to the entire show.
Big Money 01-07-2007 12:53 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Larry99
How old is Roger Smith? He helped make Paradigm City with Gordon Rosewater. Young enough to date Dorothy. Has memories of events prior to 40 years ago (correct me if I am wrong). Knows Alex Rosewater is a "tomato." Let me know what you think.


Nothing in this show makes sense. It doesn't have to, it has giant robots that break things and Schwarzwald.


Look, the show is like Lost. The guys making it just want to string you along so you want more episodes. The plot came secondary; they said they made the show so they could make toys in one of the interviews... toys which are ironically absent, I might add...
paul1290 01-07-2007 11:34 AM
Roger is 25 years old. The current Roger Smith was born 15 years after the amnesia swept through the city.
He has memories from before 40 years ago because Gordon Rosewater planted them into his mind when he was a child. In Act 13, he states that Gordon Rosewater planted memories into the minds of several children about 15 years ago. That means Roger Smith was 10 years old when Gordon gave him the memories.
The Roger Smith shaking hands with Gordon Rosewater was the previous Roger Smith from before 40 years ago. The current Roger Smith's memories most likely came from that previous Roger Smith.



If you're still not convinced that the current Roger Smith is 25 years old, here's math to prove it. I even color coded the numbers to show where they apply:

Roger was born 15 years after the amnesia, was given memories by Gordon Rosewater at age 10, and it has been 15 years since Gordon gave Roger those memories.

15 + 10 + 15 = 40 years. Which shows the timeline is consistent with the number of years since the amnesia.

10 + 15 = 25 years. So Roger Smith is in fact 25 years old.
Larry99 01-07-2007 11:38 AM
I agree that he is 25 but in episode 25 didn't Gordon say Roger was not a tomato; Alex is. Correct me if I am wrong.
paul1290 01-07-2007 12:00 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Larry99
I agree that he is 25 but in episode 25 didn't Gordon say Roger was not a tomato; Alex is. Correct me if I am wrong.


Even if Roger is not one of Gordon's tomatoes, that doesn't mean he wasn't given memories as well.

Remember, near the end of the series Roger has a flashback that shows he was one of the children who Gordon gave memories to.



However, it is worth noting that in that flashback Roger was different from the other children. He seemed to be about 10 years old while the rest of the children in the group appeared to be around 5 or 6 years old. He was also much taller than the other children.

Another interesting fact is that when R-D was hunting down the tomatoes, one of them was said to be barely 20 years old (I think her name was Ellen). That's 5 years younger than Roger. The others that R-D hunts down also seem to be of similar age.

This seems to imply that Roger was given memories despite the fact that he was 5 years older than the rest of the tomatoes in his group. That might have something to do with what you just mentioned about Roger not being like the other tomatoes.

If Roger is indeed different from the other tomatoes then that might explain why he was put into a group with others who were significantly younger than him (the ones hunted by R-D, and perhaps Angel) as opposed to being grouped with the older generation of tomatoes (Alex, Schwarzwald, and Vera).
SEELE 08 01-07-2007 12:38 PM
No that was Alex who was so much taller and older than the other children, his age i've read is 43, which means he must have been created or cloned from Gordon three years prior to the event, and the expiramentation on him must have gone on for far longer than it did with the other children as it appears they were adopted out to other families. Know better way for a father to say I love you to his son than expiramental nuerosurgery without any form of consent!

ALso i'm just saying some of Big O is as confusing as EoE and debated pretty hotly, but I will say the Big O fandom is MUCH saner. I have yet to find Big O megadeus on megadues pornography but ya'll know that Big Fau/Glinda is HAWT j/k.
Larry99 01-07-2007 01:14 PM
Speaking of R-D, wasn't her name on the list of people that Roger had? If Alex is 43 then he would have been 25 years old if the tomatos got their memories form Gordon 15 years after the "Event."
paul1290 01-07-2007 01:50 PM
quote:
Originally posted by SEELE 08
No that was Alex who was so much taller and older than the other children, his age i've read is 43, which means he must have been created or cloned from Gordon three years prior to the event, and the expiramentation on him must have gone on for far longer than it did with the other children as it appears they were adopted out to other families. Know better way for a father to say I love you to his son than expiramental nuerosurgery without any form of consent!


I'm pretty certain that the children in the flashback were given their memories 15 years ago because it was mentioned out loud in Act 13 when Roger confronts Gordon after having the same flashback. Alex would have been about 28 at that time. The tall one in the flashback didn't look anywhere near that age.

Of course, I could be wrong and there might be something I missed. I might have to re-check some of the later episodes.



quote:
Speaking of R-D, wasn't her name on the list of people that Roger had?

Yes, I'm not sure what that means either. Perhaps R-D had some of the memories too and she was supposed to commit suicide after her mission was complete. Or perhaps R-D somehow refers to someone else, maybe Roger or Dorothy. Or maybe both theories are wrong and it means something completely different. Can't really say much because there isn't enough evidence to draw much of a conclusion.
SEELE 08 01-07-2007 04:44 PM
quote:
I'm pretty certain that the children in the flashback were given their memories 15 years ago because it was mentioned out loud in Act 13 when Roger confronts Gordon after having the same flashback. Alex would have been about 28 at that time. The tall one in the flashback didn't look anywhere near that age.


I'm talking about the kid from the flashback in episode 25, the one that said "Alex" next to it's barcode on Big Fau's display, I'm guessing Roger's flashbacks are the First Roger or whatever's memories of seeing Alex when Roger was an adult not a child. Maybe the very first batch of tomatoes every created.
Larry99 01-07-2007 04:47 PM
I never thought about Roger's flashbacks being the other Roger's memories. Maybe Roger had something to do with the creation of the tomatos.
Nine Kuze 01-07-2007 04:48 PM
quote:
Originally posted by SEELE 08
quote:
I'm pretty certain that the children in the flashback were given their memories 15 years ago because it was mentioned out loud in Act 13 when Roger confronts Gordon after having the same flashback. Alex would have been about 28 at that time. The tall one in the flashback didn't look anywhere near that age.


I'm talking about the kid from the flashback in episode 25, the one that said "Alex" next to it's barcode on Big Fau's display, I'm guessing Roger's flashbacks are the First Roger or whatever's memories of seeing Alex when Roger was an adult not a child. Maybe the very first batch of tomatoes every created.

Yeah, that was indeed Alex Rosewater. From that memory, Alex realized that he was in fact another product of the tomato experiments and not actually Gordon Rosewater's actual son.

EDIT: What? In Act 26, when Roger gets that flood of memories, I think those are implied to be Angel's memories. Roger is having been shown them as well so he can carry out his own mission. True, you see the "other Roger" in the memories but I don't think they were his memories. At least, that's what I got from it and all.
Peace.
SEELE 08 01-07-2007 08:47 PM
Well Alex is Gordon's son in the sense he is the product of Gordon's genes. He just lacks a biological or genetic mother...
Capt. Quekolis 01-07-2007 09:13 PM
I just think that the whole last two episodes were all messed up and were too loosly put together because they were rushed way too much. They should have gone into more detail. Thats why they need another season. So they can fix the mess they made.
Nine Kuze 01-08-2007 05:57 AM
quote:
Originally posted by SEELE 08
Well Alex is Gordon's son in the sense he is the product of Gordon's genes. He just lacks a biological or genetic mother...

True, but in a sense, he's just another clone ("another tomato") like many others. The senators and founding fathers of Paradigm City took part in the tomato experiment because they wanted to retrive memories from beyond that of 40 years ago through the medium of the actual next generation's being.

In Act 25, Gordon himself said that Roger and Angel weren't one of his "beloved (or maybe cherished, don't remember at the moment)" tomatoes. So with that, maybe it just means that Alex was one of Gordon's favorite tomatoes to come from his own genes during the tomato experiment.
Peace.
SEELE 08 01-08-2007 11:32 AM
Hmm I always was bothered that Gordon hugged Roger, but wouldn't even hug Alex or say he loved him. I don't think he favored Alex beyond the fact he was his clone, he seemed to have completely neglected him an emotional level.