"And divine thunder will rain down..."

Valdoom 11-27-2006 06:41 PM
"The power of God, created by man... Divine thunder raining down from the heavens..."

My question is what exactally was the "divine thunder". It wasn't the lights falling down because that was different, than the divine thunder.
R. Leslie Fedeau 12-02-2006 01:11 AM
I've often heard "divine thunder" being used as a metaphor for a deity's rage itself, in unadulterated form. In Big-O context, I never looked at it as something tangible; more of a concept that God was angry at the city.

If I had to guess as to where it came from, I'd guess it's a reference to Zeus.
Nazrael 12-02-2006 04:36 PM
It's referring to Big Venus.
Big Big Moon 12-02-2006 08:35 PM
Venus rose up from underground. Besides, Venus is never referred to as "divine," and we don't even know if she was cast in the name of God. It seems to me the stagelights falling down was the obvious meaning behind Divine Thunder.
Nazrael 12-02-2006 09:40 PM
"Divine Thunder raining down from the heavens" doesn't have to mean it came from the sky. Big Venus was divine in the sense that she controlled the world. Venus was not cast in God, Angel was. Since Angel was Venus's dominus.
Valdoom 12-02-2006 09:58 PM
Angel or not the Divine thunder was not the lights falling, because they do that later, and when the lights fall they do even more damage then the "Divine Thunder". But I don't think Angel and the "Divine Thunder" are related. IF you watch the episode you'll notice that Angel doesn't act an differantly before or after the lightning starts. If anything it may have been activated by the Ressuection of Big Fau.
Shadow 02-03-2007 08:47 AM
Does the statement not refer to the Megadeus War....as I recall during the flashback when we saw Big Venus there were lasers being shot from it's mouth this would be a reference to Zeus, the Father of the Gods, who could shot lighting bolts. If this is true then maybe the statement is a reference to the destruction that was caused or can be done Venus.

Also since Venus is of God in Paradigm maybe it was given this role as a reference to Zeus and his powers......

Of course I might just be rambling...
SEELE 08 02-03-2007 10:08 AM
I thought the falling bomb/light things were the Union planes bombing the city.
Shadow 02-03-2007 11:18 AM
But was it really planes???

When Duo Inferno took Alan into the sky I couldn't see any planes or flying things at all just the huge lights. Maybe the lights aren't realy light but huge bomb dropping machines or the bomb units are near them.

Was there really people outside of Paradigm??
Or was the people who said they were from outside Paradigm just people with false ids and notes?
SEELE 08 02-03-2007 02:03 PM
No Gordon and Alex both say that the Union is just a "tiny gathering of people among the ruins". They originate from inside the city (Gordon kicked them out for being crappy tomatoes, but oddly kept Alex around).
THe planes flying overhead appeared to be similar to modern stealth bombers (or those cool eva carrying planes from Evangelion, which I have the cutest little model of)
Shadow 02-03-2007 03:06 PM
but that's what I mean...where did the planes come from...not even Gordon(as far as I know) didn't have a plane(s)..so how did the Union have some?

Plus I thought the Union got help supposed from the Outside but if Paradigm is just a stage with only the residents of Paradigm inside then how could there be anyone else on the stage?
Nine Kuze 02-03-2007 03:25 PM
quote:
Originally posted by SEELE 08
The planes flying overhead appeared to be similar to modern stealth bombers (or those cool eva carrying planes from Evangelion, which I have the cutest little model of)

There were no planes, that was a red herring to have an illusion firsthand that there was an actual Union before exposing the truth about them. The bombs that were destroying Paradigm City were the stagelights from the superdome that Big Fau and the Military Police were firing on, thinking that there were an enemy fleet of planes there. But alas.

The Union, which is suppose to be thought of as a separate group of people entirely from Paradigm City, doesn't exist because the people who thought they were born outside of Paradigm City were actually born inside of it. That's why when Gordon says that the Union didn't exist, Vera's barcode in her eye flashed revealing the truth about the Union.

quote:
Originally posted by Shadow
But was it really planes???

When Duo Inferno took Alan into the sky I couldn't see any planes or flying things at all just the huge lights. Maybe the lights aren't realy light but huge bomb dropping machines or the bomb units are near them.

What? It was just the superdome. Schwarzwald exposed that truth to the rest of the citizens when he crashed Big Duo into the lights (those were the bombs "divine thunder" that were destroying Paradigm City). There were no "bomb dropping machines" or "bomb units up there" (where... do you people come up with half of this stuff?), it was just the superdome, which is reflected to show that Paradigm City itself is nothing more than a grand stage.
Peace.
Zopwx2 02-03-2007 04:16 PM
Alex: He thought that fau was the big with the power to reshape paradigm, and he thought the falling junk was fau's power at work.

Vera/Union: Thought the falling sh** was her union bombers.

But it was just metal sh** falling from the sky because either it got old and fell on its own, duo inferno f***ed the whole thing up when it flew up, alex knocked sh** loose w/ fau and the MP, or a combination of the previous.
DorothyFan1 02-03-2007 09:13 PM
Very good point about Schwarzwald deliberately crashing the body of Inferno Duo into the Skydome. I never thought about it this way...excellent. Now...about the "divine thunderbolts"...I'm surprised nobody mentions this...but when Big Fau is resurrected...Alex Rosewater ignited its shoulder rocket guns and you can see them clearly firing off into the sky...causing the "divine thunderbolts" to fall and destroy the city.

Alex ignites the "divine thunderbolts" all by himself. However, this presumes Alex already KNEW Paradigm City was just a gigantic holoprogram. I don't think we can go that far because toward the end of Act 26...we see Alex looking at the sky and saying "What's happening to MY world?" He didn't have a clue what was going on.
Malkhos 02-03-2007 09:32 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Shadow
Does the statement not refer to the Megadeus War....as I recall during the flashback when we saw Big Venus there were lasers being shot from it's mouth this would be a reference to Zeus, the Father of the Gods, who could shot lighting bolts. If this is true then maybe the statement is a reference to the destruction that was caused or can be done Venus.

Also since Venus is of God in Paradigm maybe it was given this role as a reference to Zeus and his powers......

Of course I might just be rambling...


This is exactly right. The thing that separated Zeus from mortals and even the other gods was the Thunderbolt, and the same concept is transfered to the christian God by Milton (the first thing Lucifer says to Beelzebub in Hell is esentially, "Who knew god's thunderbolts could do that to us!"), and obviously it refers to the military power of the Megadei, espcially whaterver that rather phallaic looking cannon Big O used in the 'Final Phase.'
Nazrael 02-03-2007 09:35 PM
quote:
Originally posted by DorothyFan1
Very good point about Schwarzwald deliberately crashing the body of Inferno Duo into the Skydome. I never thought about it this way...excellent. Now...about the "divine thunderbolts"...I'm surprised nobody mentions this...but when Big Fau is resurrected...Alex Rosewater ignited its shoulder rocket guns and you can see them clearly firing off into the sky...causing the "divine thunderbolts" to fall and destroy the city.

Alex ignites the "divine thunderbolts" all by himself. However, this presumes Alex already KNEW Paradigm City was just a gigantic holoprogram. I don't think we can go that far because toward the end of Act 26...we see Alex looking at the sky and saying "What's happening to MY world?" He didn't have a clue what was going on.


He probably thought he was destroying Union bombers. He just didn't care that anything in Paradigm would get destroyed, since he was a "God" he could simply rebuld it. Thus the quote,

"Throw down your thunderbolts! And burn down this city! I am the son of the King, the man who rebuilt this world! I will recreate this world myself! But before I do, all of you who don't deserve to exist in my world will be eliminated, and that includes you filthy scum!"
SEELE 08 02-03-2007 09:43 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Nazrael
quote:
Originally posted by DorothyFan1
Very good point about Schwarzwald deliberately crashing the body of Inferno Duo into the Skydome. I never thought about it this way...excellent. Now...about the "divine thunderbolts"...I'm surprised nobody mentions this...but when Big Fau is resurrected...Alex Rosewater ignited its shoulder rocket guns and you can see them clearly firing off into the sky...causing the "divine thunderbolts" to fall and destroy the city.

Alex ignites the "divine thunderbolts" all by himself. However, this presumes Alex already KNEW Paradigm City was just a gigantic holoprogram. I don't think we can go that far because toward the end of Act 26...we see Alex looking at the sky and saying "What's happening to MY world?" He didn't have a clue what was going on.


He probably thought he was destroying Union bombers. He just didn't give a sh** that anything in Paradigm would get destroyed, since he was a "God" he could simply rebuld it. Thus the quote,

"Throw down your thunderbolts! And burn down this city! I am the son of the King, the man who rebuilt this world! I will recreate this world myself! But before I do, all of you who don't deserve to exist in my world will be eliminated, and that includes you filthy scum!"


Well since he did essentially become Big Fau, he kinda was a god in some minor way. But not nearly in the league of Angel/Big Venus.
Zopwx2 02-03-2007 11:33 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Nazrael
quote:
Originally posted by DorothyFan1
Very good point about Schwarzwald deliberately crashing the body of Inferno Duo into the Skydome. I never thought about it this way...excellent. Now...about the "divine thunderbolts"...I'm surprised nobody mentions this...but when Big Fau is resurrected...Alex Rosewater ignited its shoulder rocket guns and you can see them clearly firing off into the sky...causing the "divine thunderbolts" to fall and destroy the city.

Alex ignites the "divine thunderbolts" all by himself. However, this presumes Alex already KNEW Paradigm City was just a gigantic holoprogram. I don't think we can go that far because toward the end of Act 26...we see Alex looking at the sky and saying "What's happening to MY world?" He didn't have a clue what was going on.


He probably thought he was destroying Union bombers. He just didn't care that anything in Paradigm would get destroyed, since he was a "God" he could simply rebuld it. Thus the quote,

"Throw down your thunderbolts! And burn down this city! I am the son of the King, the man who rebuilt this world! I will recreate this world myself! But before I do, all of you who don't deserve to exist in my world will be eliminated, and that includes you filthy scum!"


I agree with:

He didn't necesssarilly know there was a superdome up there, but alex for whatever reason believed that fau had some sort of power that would enable him to cause another "event" like he believed gordon caused, in addition to fighting non existent union bombers.

Although it turned out fau was just the "water" big and venus was the one who actually had that power.
Shadow 02-04-2007 07:42 AM
I argee with that....so Rosewater was thinking was the Big with the power of god while it turned out just to be a Water-Combat version Big.......hmmm then that's it then

However I still think my Zeus theory has some reference.