Episode 51 Discussion- The Final Episode

Nine Kuze 03-23-2006 03:02 PM
Actually, I have always thought that the Elric brothers were separated by one year. In the episode (I think its Dante of the Deep Forest) Alphonse said to Martel, Roa, and Dolette that was fourteen years old and at that time, Edward was fifteen.

quote:
I'm still a little confused as to why Ed first appeared in 1916 London on the other side of the gate only to end up in 1921 Germany the second time. I really don't think that 5 years have passed for Ed by the end of the series, or that he's 21. We saw him still gathering information about rockets and technology to try to get back to his world and just now leaving on a trip. I think he'd be a lot futher along in his plans/ideas/understanding of "our" world if he'd spent that much time there. At any rate, I'm pretty sure Ed is still supposed to be 16 at the end of the series.

Um, that's true Shreder and I have to agree with this. Maybe Edward is not older (like the age of 21) but he definetly seemed like it. And if he's still the same age when he crossed the Gate again, how can the time be both 1921 and Edward still being around fifteen years old.

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The movie takes place two years later, making Ed 18 and Al 12.

I've seen a little something-something of the movie, and Alphonse sure as hell doesn't look twelve years old. Like, for example...

or this one...


You can judge for yourself but he doesn't seem 12 years old to me.

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Also, we only saw Ed in 1921; if Al is indeed younger than 17 or 18 when he is talking to Izumi, Ill take it to mean that we havent seen the 5-6 years elapse on Al's side of the gate, which puts him at 12 or 13.

That's a very good point there, Stevie. Mentioning if MIGHT not have shown the five year lapse in Al's world, but only in our world. That's rather interesting. But why the hell would they do that? As you can tell, its quite confusing.
Peace.
Shredder 03-23-2006 10:02 PM
Yeah, but in the movie, there's another Al on Ed's side of the gate who is a year/year and a half younger than Ed, as Al would normally be. While he looks a little different (blonde/blue eyed), I'm pretty sure he's supposed to represent what Al would be like as an older teen/adult. He's tall and is voiced by a male voice actor (instead of his kid voice, which was done by a woman in the Japanese version). The Al on the FMA world side of the gate looks older than before, but still has the kid voice.
Nine Kuze 03-23-2006 10:12 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Shredder
Yeah, but in the movie, there's another Al on Ed's side of the gate who is a year/year and a half younger than Ed, as Al would normally be. While he looks a little different (blonde/blue eyed), I'm pretty sure he's supposed to represent what Al would be like as an older teen/adult. He's tall and is voiced by a male voice actor (instead of his kid voice, which was done by a woman in the Japanese version). The Al on the FMA world side of the gate looks older than before, but still has the kid voice.

Yeah, there is a boy on the Other Side of the Gate that looks like Alphonse Elric. His name is Alphonse Heiderich (hope I spelled that right Big Grin ) and Hohenheim and Edward talked about there being a boy that is physically identical to Alphonse as well as Edward in the "Death" episode. That's him.

But, then if Al Elric is older, why does he still have the kid's voice? I swear, they're doing this to me on purpose.
Peace.
Schoolie 03-23-2006 11:28 PM
Quick question about the last episode:

Did AS cut out part of the confrontation between Archer and Mustang?

This occus as Mustang walks out of Pride/Fuhrer's mansion carrying the son's body. Then Robo-Archer confronts Mustang. The next thing we see his Hawkeye running up and shooting Archer. And then Hawkeye kneels beside a fallen Mustang, whose his face/head is a lot bloodier than it was the moment we saw it earlier.

The reason this caught my eye was because AS added a special bumper at the beginning of the show with an extra warning about the violence and how they were too lazy to edit it out.

Of course, there is plenty of vivid violence - from Envy's impaling of Ed to Pride's stabbing and blade-wrenching on Mustang to Pride's strangling of his own kid. Man, what a bad guy.
Krang 03-24-2006 12:22 AM
Actually, that scene was not edited from the original version. It is implied that Archer shoots Mustang (causing him to lose an eye), although it is never shown.
evanASF27 03-24-2006 01:22 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Krang
Actually, that scene was not edited from the original version. It is implied that Archer shoots Mustang (causing him to lose an eye), although it is never shown.

Some of the best scenes in film (and anime) history were never seen.

Implying something is sometimes more dramatic than showing it unfold blatantly. And for the above scene with Mustang vs. Archer-4000, I am glad we didn't actually see him shoot Mustang. It built up alot more suspense Big Grin (plus, hundreds of Roy fangirls would cry Sweatdrop )
AlexRosewater 03-25-2006 10:31 PM
Sorry for the late post but this English project has me working my tail off.

A very great ending. everything I hoped and even more that happened in this episode left me breath less. I LOVED IT!!! I also, like how Roy is still a ladies man even with one eye. Well, now my saturdays are now filled with nothing to do anymore since I allways waited for the new episode every saturday... well, on to the Manga!!!!
Chitter-Box-Kat 03-28-2006 03:36 PM
That was amazing! Incredible! ENVY TURNED INTO A FREAKING (censored for spoiler content)!!!! Shocked Shocked Shocked
HE LOOKED SO D**N COOL!
I can't get over how self-sacrificing Ed and Al were for each other. H**l, I can't believe Wrath survived and got Automail limbs. Oo
But I do like what happeed to Dante. She deserved her fate. (laughs evily) Pleased
Now I have one goal remaining as far as FMA is concerned. MUST-SEE-THE MOVIE!!! (walks of in zombified state)
Nine Kuze 03-28-2006 04:09 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Zenigata-Da-Vida
Some of the best scenes in film (and anime) history were never seen.

Alfred Hitchcock's Psycho is the best example I can think of at the time. You don't actually see Norman Bates kill her, you just see the drain and blood going down it.

Also, the remake of Scarface with both Tony Montana and his partner tied up in a shower and the dealers have a chainsaw. Never see him actually attack them with the chainsaw, just see lots of blood spraying everywhere.
Peace.
Barrin 06-20-2006 01:36 PM
Dang, took me too long to catch up and discussion is done. Well, time to open it up again.

It took a bit for it to all soak in. The action, the drama, the sheer coolness if it all. This was closure, but it did leave you wanting to go see the movie. from what I've been told by dodging spoilers, it's nearly self contained. Seeing the series is not an absolute prerequisite. Mustang and Hawkeye are a great pair. They had a professional relationship for some time, and now that the mess has cleared, there may be some alone time for them. Don't know if Izumi will be around for the movie; it seems she's becoming more sickly.

Just some questions that may or may not need answering:
1. Who created Archer's automail? Man, that was creepy.
2. Who was the basis for Pride? Was he a product of revival, or is he 100% origional?
3. I can see how each homunculus embodies a deadly sin, but I can't see it in Sloth or Pride.
4. Envy's transfoprmation at the end. Has he become an Ouroboros?
5. Gluttony's origins.
6. Who did Pride marry? Can Homunculi breed?
7. Anyone else feel like the homunculi were becoming more human?


P.S. Yes, this is my first post in almost a year. College kicked in, and I had to record shows for later viewing. I only got to this episode last Saturday, so I'm about 3 months behind showings.
Nine Kuze 06-20-2006 02:17 PM
Hi Barrin, I'm Nine XXVI. I came around when I guess you were taking your year hiatus. Anyway, let me try to help with some of your questions:

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Don't know if Izumi will be around for the movie; it seems she's becoming more sickly.

spoiler (highlight to read):
She's not. She dies before the movie takes place.


quote:
1. Who created Archer's automail? Man, that was creepy.

Don't know, I would have to guess some of the same alchemists or other scientists that created all the chimeras. But yeah, that was weird.

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2. Who was the basis for Pride? Was he a product of revival, or is he 100% origional?

Since he is a homunculus, he is a product of revival. There's a popular theory going around that Pride could have been the result of a transmutation of one of Hohenheim's old bodies given to him by Dante. In the "A Rotted Heart" episode, Dante goes over how Hohenheim of Light created the first ever Philosopher's Stone. The process took its toll on his original body and he almost died when Dante took the stone and used it to transfer his soul into another person nearby. Hohenheim lived in that person's body and I'm thinking that when that body was rotting away, Dante tried a human transmutation, failed, and created Pride. Because the person whose body that Hohenheim and Dante took that first time looked like Pride. So, yeah, that's where Pride might come from.

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3. I can see how each homunculus embodies a deadly sin, but I can't see it in Sloth or Pride.

Um, that's kind of true but it is evident for them as well. Remember the fight with Pride and Mustang? Pride showed that he was very much full of himself and he does this throughout the entire series. Its not as obvious as someone like Envy or Gluttony but Pride has a lot of pride and is very much full of himself. That was his downfall against Roy Mustang.

As for Sloth, well her traits to her sin is very less obvious than that of Pride but in the Greed saga, she was slow in handling her part of the job as Lust said during that time. But she doesn't seem all that slow. And also, I think in Dante's book (the real philosopher), there were different fates of people who committed one of the seven sins. In the case of sloth, people who committed this sin were repeatedly drown to death. Or something along those lines, I know that it involves dying in the result of water and I strongly think that's where the creators got the idea of Sloth's hydrokinetic powers.

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4. Envy's transfoprmation at the end. Has he become an Ouroboros?

Envy's transformation at the end (where he for the last time morphs into a dragon) and is sent back to the other side of the gate continues in the movie where...
spoiler (highlight to read):
the Thule Society uses him as a living ouroboros as a catalyst for a gateway to connect the two worlds, our world and alchemic world. The Thule Society does this so they can get into the other world and take it over.

So basically, yes.

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5. Gluttony's origins.

They never even entertain the thought of mentioning his origins. All I know, from what was given from the series, is that Gluttony probably the fourth homunculi that was created. In order from oldest to youngest, it goes Envy, Greed, Pride, Gluttony, Lust, Wrath, and Sloth. Also, it seems that at the end, Gluttony's main purpose was to create a perfect Philosopher's Stone within his stomach. He was going to do this to Alphonse Elric before he stopped him. That's all I know because the series never really touches on Gluttony on that kind of level.

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6. Who did Pride marry? Can Homunculi breed?

Pride probably married someone has a family in power in the state of Amestris. Since he was Dante's clutch to rule the country, her and Pride probably needed him to marry someone that the people and government would notice. Like when a person runs for a political office and all of a sudden has a wife, two kids, and dog. Its the same emphasis as that. And no, homunculi can't breed. Pride's son, Selim, was adopted by him and his wife.

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7. Anyone else feel like the homunculi were becoming more human?

Yeah, especially the youngest of the three, Sloth, Wrath, and Lust. They all are basically human, the expection of having no soul. But Lust seemed the most determined to become human and its not really sure if Dante really could have given them souls or make them human with the Philosopher's Stone. She probably wasn't going to, but not really sure if she even if wanted.

Well, I hope this helps Barrin and I'll probably see you around the forums. Smile
Peace.